If you are not sure why you are not getting cast for voiceover work then read this post.
How This Blog Came To Mind
I was reading a post recently from a slightly disillusioned-sounding chap on our Facebook group who was asking whether anyone had got any work from subscription casting websites such as VoicesPro, Voice123, Voices.com etc. The overriding answer on the thread was that there wasn’t much work coming back to the posters. So the question really is why are you not getting cast for voiceover work.
The question is…Why?
I’ve recently had experience with one of these sites from the casting side of the fence, and I thought this blog might help answer that question. If you think about it, there are only two possible reasons as to why people think they are not getting cast for voiceover work when using subscription sites: the subscription sites don’t have enough work on them or aren’t attracting the right clients, or the voices aren’t getting the jobs that are being put forward for them.
Why Getting Cast for Voiceover Work Has Changed
But let’s back-up a bit. Times, they are a-changing as they say, and the old system of agents getting all the work are rapidly dissapearing. I cast now from three places:
First, my list of agents (sic!); this is a great starting place for me as (usually) the agents do have top-drawer talent on their books – it may not be fair that you’re not with an agent, but it’s most definitely a good idea to get one if you can. Agents have up-sides and down-sides though. The up-side from my point of view is that their talent are (usually) very dependable, are experienced, and most of the time are trained. (Agents also tend to be very well connected, and therefore get lots of good work for their voices). The downside is that there is a markup for the agent within the (higher) fee, and that the agents are very slow to move with the times, especially with regard to producing things like gaming reels for their talent etc.
The second place I cast is from my own lists, containing the people who I know are trained in either gaming or tv acting/VO. I’ve already written a separate blog on why training is necessary, but suffice to say, this is a casting list which my company holds, of actors who I know I can trust to get the job done and who I don’t have to train in front of clients.
Thirdly, the subscription model of casting websites – which is what we actually care about in this blog.
Why You Aren’t Getting Cast for Voiceover Work
So for each game/show I do, the casting net does go pretty far and relatively wide. It’s worth bearing this in mind when you haven’t been cast for the 20th job you’ve gone for that month…
How they treat Casting Directors
My experience of working with VoicesPro was that it is a fantastic service and that everything was made very easy for me. So much so that I’ll definitely be casting with them again. This is what you’d expect though – if they didn’t get that bit right, they wouldn’t get any work for their subscribers. They were also pro-active with me in terms of getting work, but then again, you’d expect them to be so – but I thought I’d point it out, in case you think they sit their just thumbing your bank notes!
The game in question, some of you may have seen, was called Tanks (which wasn’t the game’s actual title, but good enough to get over the NDA) and I put out three simple lines of test-copy and a very brief character description.
I received back (from VoicesPro, disregarding the other two casting places) circa 70 submissions for the game. Of those, around 20 people submitted previous demo’s and the other 50 recorded the lines for me. Within that list of 70 actors, over 80% of the people included more than 5 reels showing previous work, other demo’s etc.
Put yourself in my shoes
So before I tell you how I chose the voices, ask yourself this: What do you think I am looking for?! Put yourself in the casting director’s shoes: If you went for that title (and if not, think about your other castings), did you think about what I actually wanted to hear, what I wanted to find and what I have to do with the clips, or did you just think about how to deliver the line?! So what is involved in getting cast for voiceover work?
Well, I’ll tell you. In this case, I was being employed by a client to cast their game for them, and record and produce all the dialogue. I am the casting director, as well as the voice director, but I don’t have 100% final veto on the voices – the games publisher does. In fact, it was a discussion between us of the final shortlist of voices that I had selected. This means….yes…I have to send your clips to the publisher once I’ve shortlisted them, along with your CV proving that you are a credible actor.
What does that mean for me? It means that I have to vouch for you. That means I have to present the absolute cream of the crop so that they publishers are happy that the 25 selected voices can be trusted not to f*** up their £3M investment and 2-years development time, by marring the voice acting.
So for me to vouch for you, I have to be sure that you are the cream of the crop. You may think that I only ever then cast people I know, but in fact, for this title, all of the actors that got the job were unknown to me and cast purely on their casting response.
What did I receive?
Well you would have thought that in order to get to the top of the pile of all those voices, everyone would have recorded the three lines I sent out, but no. 20 voices sent me stock reels, and mostly non-targeted reels, i.e., Galaxy chocolate commercials. And yes, you’d be right in thinking that I put them all straight in the bin.
Why You Aren’t Getting Cast For Voiceover Work – Schoolboy Errors
Then, of the people who did record the lines, and I’m not joking here, around 50% of the people ‘spoke’ the lines into a microphone and that was that. Did that fulfil the brief of a soldier in the army, in mid-battle and in a tank? No. Did it fulfil the brief of placing that character into a game environment, with intensity and dramatic emphasis? No. Guess what I did with them? Yes, I put them in the bin.
Schoolboy Errors
So that leaves around 25 voices who were in with a shot. At least 10 of these voices didn’t slate the reels – i.e., “Hugh Edwards, Army Soldier, test lines” – at the start, so I couldn’t tell what their real vs character voices was like. That’s very sloppy and a schoolboy error which is so easily fixed. Three of the recordings had been recorded and (quite obviously) not listened to before being sent, as they were completely unintelligible.
One had 15 seconds of space at the start which would have meant that I would have had to download the clip, and trim it before I sent it to the Publisher – binned – I’m sorry but I’m a casting director, not your own personal sound editor. So this is one of the main reasons for not getting cast for voiceover work.
But still, that said, there were some good performances in there. Of the 25 good performances, I favourited around 10 voices, and that was just because they sounded more appropriate for the job.
Those 10 voices were then compiled with the other shortlisted clips that I had from the Agents lists and our own in-house casting lists. We had a total of 20 shortlisted candidates for 3 roles, out of a total of nearly 200 submissions.
But what about my Showreels?!
But what about Gaming reels, or other showreels/demo-reels that were pre-recorded and sent with the voice clips I hear you ask? A good point. Of the shortlisted clips, I had listened to each of the potential voices other reels as well as the voiced-lines and that did help narrow it down a little. As much as anything, those reels show the ‘Best Of” that voice and what they really can do, as opposed to how they voiced these lines. So to getting cast for voiceover work you need to deliver what is needed.
(If that’s confusing to you it’s because each job is cast differently depending on the job and the brief. Sometimes I listen solely to recorded reels, sometimes I request lines, sometimes it’s a live-casting, sometimes we have voices come to the studio and try-out, sometimes it’s based on something different altogether. In this case, pre-rec’ reels were a backup of the voices recorded clips, to further illustrate the talents of the voice artist.)
The Final Showdown
So the publisher and I sat down and went through the voices. There wasn’t the budget for a live casting, so we went through each set of clips and each person’s CV (if you didn’t have a CV, then your name wasn’t Dave and you weren’t getting in) and made our final choices.
Who won?
So here’s the crux of what you probably want to know…how did we end up choosing the 3 voices we finally chose? Well, firstly, it’s worth saying that 2 out of the 3 roles came from Voices Pro and one from an Agent. All were based on their clips and their CV.
Each sucessful voice had recorded the lines more than once. In one actor’s recording, he’d done it perfectly and it went like this: “John Doe, Tank Game Test……English…..blah blah blah……American……Blah Blah Blah…..English Harder…Blah Blah Blah….English Mid-Battle High Intensity….Blah Blah Blah…..English Scared….Blah Blah Blah….” – and by the end of that set of lines, which only took about 2 minutes, I just knew that he was not only versitile, and could do the lines with great character delivery, but that he actually ‘got’ what we were trying to do – he’d thought about it, and he actually cared. Getting cast for voiceover work means that you have passion for the job and demonstrate it, you want to do you best and strive to achieve it.
That’s someone you can trust. That’s someone who wasn’t just sifting through the e-learning jobs, the phone recordings, the kids toy scripts and the games demo’s for that day – he actually cared enough to be passionate about it.
Now…I’m sure that many of the unsuccesful voices also cared about it just as much – its just that it didn’t come across in their performance. And I couldn’t then vouch for them. And I couldn’t then send the clips onto the publishers and say categorically “This guy is the one.”
The Good, The Bad and The Yawnworthy
Ask yourself now is that how you conduct your career? Is it really that hard to try and put yourself right in the middle of a scene and convince me that you’re the best actor of your generation?? The three successful candidates showed me just how good they were, and then had great showreels and a CV all ready to go – their ducks were in a nice neat line. Getting cast for voiceover work is competitive so realise that you need to completely professional at every stage.
Working with What You’re Given
And the funny thing is, there were many actors who went for the role who I actually know, and who I actually know are good actors. It’s just that they didn’t put me in a position where, next to the other guys, I just couldn’t not pick them forthose particular characters.
Make it up as you go along
Some people may also complain that there were only 3 lines to work with, and that my character description was way too brief. This however was on purpose, and in fact is a bit of a test to see what you do with nothing. So if you’re in that position, then give three or four different reads and be exciting, calm, flamboyant, dramatic, tense etc with your deliveries. If just makes you look so much better as an actor.
I hope that helps – getting yourself cast is easy really – just make put me in a position where I have to cast you because you’re that good. The people who got cast already did this, at least in this game I did.
I know there are some seasoned actors out there who won’t want to move with the times, and will complain that it’s just not like the old days where a trip to visit the Agent would line them up for the next 6 months of work…but things have moved on – the marketplace is a lot more flooded and diverse, and you have to fight to get yourself heard. I hope these tips help you in getting cast for voiceover work.
Just remember – we are listening…..
Hi Hugh,
Thanks for a very insightful and (I hope for me) helpful blog. I’m a newbie to VO, and have been training for a few months now with the boys over at The Showreel in London. I’m thinking of coming along to your July ‘Social’ – I hope to introduce myself then! regards – Craig Van Ness
Thank you for answering “why?” and explaining “how” without muddling the middle. This was very helpful for me..
Hubert Williams
Hi Hugh,
Thanks for the insight. I was on Voices for a while, and 90% of the jobs I auditioned for specified not to slate. Am I right in assuming this is not the accepted wisdom?
Hi Leland – yes – the rule is that you absolutely slate 100% of the time unless you are specifically asked not to, and then of course, as with all castings, you must follow the casting instructions. 🙂
Hugh
Hi Hugh
I’d always resisted slating – until reading what you had to say.
I’m interested exactly what the perfect slate should say though… is it “Your name” then “Job title” then “character name” (if applicable) then the word “sample” then the audition piece… or is it something else. Could you perhaps give an example or two?
Thanks
Mark
Hi Mark. Sure:
“Hugh Edwards – Commercial Reel”
“Hugh Edwards – Ford Demo”
“Hugh Edwards – Gaming Reel”
“Hugh Edwards – War Gaming Demo”
“Hugh Edwards – Kelloggs Demo”
…and so on. 🙂
Hi guys,
Fabulous read, I am at the point where I can’t get onto any of the v.o websites due to lack of credits. It’s the old conundrum of needing credit to get work but need work to get credits!!!
Any tips and advice on where to start would be awesome.
Many thanks
Ian
Hi Ian.
Most of the P2P sites such as voices.com and voice123.com do not require you to have experience, syou could go on these and gain experience and then move about when you’re ready. 🙂
Hugh
And … update your profile on all the places you’re listed including casting sites – add new and recent voice samples, details of new equipment etc. If you have installed a home studio since you first joined a casting site … or added ISDN or Source Connect … add that info to your profile page. So many people have out of date information on their profiles … and may be discounted because of that alone.
Very true Helen. 🙂
Fab,
Thanks for your advice guys, appreciate it
Great read, there is no luck….Preparation meets opportunity. I want to immerse myself into the effort but currently I am hampered by the lack of facilities but I totally get it
Thank you for the incite…
You’re welcome! 🙂
The multiple take approach is something I’ve adopted only recently and I’ve found myself being shortlisted for a lot more than previous auditions for games and animated projects.
I’ve even found that giving the casting director something that they hadn’t considered before sometimes makes you shine in a pile of 100 auditions that are all yelling ‘open fire!’
This is brilliant advice but the P2P stuff especially I find is a battle of attrition. There are so many factors out of your control. The only thing in your control is to give a good performance, follow instruction and let the client worry about if you’re a good fit. I tend to not obsess over likes and shortlisting, just onto the next one.
Brilliant stuff Hugh!
Hi Chris.
Yep – all true! Thanks for the comment – you’re right, it is about attrition, but we go on a guide of 1/10 jobs conversion rate once our course has been taken – the Improve Your Casting Chances course that is, which is designed for exactly this topic.
Very helpful post, thanks! I just joined GftB and am looking forward to more in the future. More gravy on my mashed potatoes of a brain, please 🙂
You’re more than welcome! Welcome to GFTB! 🙂
OMG! I have done at least 50 auditions and never slated one because I thought this wasn’t a standard. I had seen so often on Voices requests not to slate so I adopted that method.
Thank you for the insight.
You’re more than welcome Aishah. Just remember the golden rule – if you’re told *not* to slate then don’t as you should always follow the casting rules 🙂
How in the world are we ever going to build a credible CV? Even if we did all the things that are suggested in the article above, there’s still a very real chance we won’t get cast, because my CV is lasking compared to the other 9 finalists.
Perfect example…..today I submitted auditions for 7 jobs on one of the subscription sites I belong to…..I received 4 likes (which are not all that easy to get)…..but no jobs.
Hi April.
It’s a good question. Go and watch the How to Get Voiceover Work webinar that’s in the webinar library – it will show you how! 🙂
Hugh.
The first thing I’ve read or viewed since joining GFtB. Just listening to the community discuss and the veterans respond has been a rich learning experience already. I really look forward to developing within, and contributing to the VO community. Apologies for simply enthusing but many many thanks.
bc
That’s very kind William – thanks for the comments – glad you’re enjoying it! 🙂
Some great advice. Especially good to read what the other side of our business is looking for and how they cut through the amount of auditions submitted.
It seems strange that Voices.com are adamant that you should not slate any auditions. They even have a specific part of their literature that says that you should not slate. Why would they recommend this when people e who are hiring talent think it is important to hear the real voice in the slate?
Okayyyyy! This is exactly the kind of info I (we) need. Not really knowing what is going on at the other end, is terribly frustrating. My main issue is just what are the clients listening to my attempts on….laptop…studio speakers….headphones…earbuds…the phone….semaphore? I realize I can’t know this …but wouldn’t it be nice to know?
What I’m saying is that any info to how things happen out there, is super valuable so ….keep it coming.
I’d also really like to know what engineers expect, and do they influence the audition with their opinions?
I shut up now!
Thanks,
~ray
Hi Ray – glad you like it. Check out the webinar library in the members area where there is lots more on this, and of course the Improve Your Casting Chances course which is in the courses area of the dashboard. Good luck!
Hi Hugh, Joined in on your recent webinar the other day. very interesting info, thank you for some really useful stuff there 😉 I’m just getting back into voice over work, as I am also a professional musician and have been away touring a lot the last few years, but now have time to re kindle my passion for VO work! I was professionally trained back in 2009 and had secured a reasonable amount of VO work from P2P sites, which are great. Was never really that clued up on the casting bit, especially slating, so a big thanks to you for that insight from your side 😉 Look forward to checking more great stuff from you guys at GFTB! Thanks again and wishing everyone success with their VO career too 😉 Best. Nick
You’re more than welcome Nick! 🙂
Brilliant blog Hugh on a subject that’s often an enigma within a question.
Thanks for answering a few of those.
I did start out in the agent casting era and have progressed to p2p as well.
Exciting times as we embrace the technology.
Now lets all make better demos with all the right ingredients. After all you can’t bake a tasty cake if you leave out the eggs.
Cheers Walt
Hi Hugh,
thank you so much for this – there have been days when I’ve just wondered what on Earth was going wrong!
I’m on both The Voice Realm and Voices Pro (now, of course, Mandy), and because I joined the former first, I’d made the assumption that the way they do things (don’t slate your name or production details) would be the way other online VO sites worked too. Should have done my homework earlier!
Hello Hugh,
Thanks so much for your comments/reflections. The anonymous/faceless nature of on-line auditioning can turn anyone – even those of us who naturally express our emotions freely – into a robot. My coach says each & every mic encounter requires connecting with the writer’s intention & making it personal! For me, this precious commodity of time is the juggling ball. On-line auditions are always so time-sensitive. But if time up-front is not invested to make the performance (audition) “right”, it’s simply a waste. As you mentioned, here’s where an agent’s help filtering the most likely scripts would improve the process efficiency rate. Someday – but for now, I’m still juggling! Thanks again – valuable insight!.
Hugh,
Thanks so much for the insight. I’m waiting for my equipment to come in the mail. I’m in Texas and I’m thinking you will hear from me soon.
Russ DeWolfe
Thanks Russ! 🙂
Hi Hugh, thanks for this incredibly informative post! I’m on The Voice Realm and Voices. I just want to be sure I’m hearing you crystal clear: even though both of these sites discourage slating, you’re recommending that I do, unless the *client* specifically asks talent not to in their casting directions? I’ve heard that directors sometimes only listen to the first 5 seconds – wouldn’t slating take me out of the running in those instances? I really appreciate your insights!
I’ve read a lot about how the P2P sites just don’t work and this is a wonderful incite as to why that may be! This along with Webinar #10 will be really beneficial when I begin using the P2P sites. Thank you!
Hi Hugh,
As I’m going through the career planner I must stop and say this is one of the best posts I’ve seen thus far – really helps me picture the breakdown on your side of the pond. Great work.
Thanks for the great advice, I’m raring to put it into practice
Hi Hugh, great insight. Re-enforcing some points made in previous coaching materials, which is good because some things do take more time to sink in. Very helpful to get a perspective from the other side of the situation.